[SlabumniLoviets]

Originally Posted by Lt. Kettch

Good, I'll let them know.

Do you think they don't know it themselves? CERN is more than a physics laboratory...

[Spammy]

Originally Posted by I'm Me

US is not western

I hope you mean geographically, not culturally or politically.

[SlabumniLoviets]

Originally Posted by Spammy

I hope you mean geographically, not culturally or politically.

US isn't western geographically, politically and culturally. Geographically it is in the east of East Asia.

Europeans usually more aware of world politics and issues and definitely more cultural. An average ten year old kid in France, Belgium or Greece is more aware about the world and smarter than most 20+ old Americans.

European politics is different from US too, while US is based on an absolutisation republic, European countries have a more open and majority based government, there isn't much chance to manipulate votes.

Americans are geographically, politically and culturally alienated from the world. This gives them a stereotyped view of the world and a narrow opinions coupled with inability to see through contradictory politics.

[Spammy]

Originally Posted by I'm Me

Europeans are usually more aware of world politics and issues and definitely more cultural. An average ten year old kid in France, Belgium or Greece is more aware about the world and smarter than most 20+ old Americans.

Say what you want about the U.S. not being a culturally western country, even though it is considered by most to be western. As for 20 year olds not knowing politics, it's believable, but most of them don't vote anyway. Defining who's more cultural depends on how you define it, but I'd personally say Europe is.

[SlabumniLoviets]

Originally Posted by Spammy

Say what you want about the U.S. not being a culturally western country, even though it is considered by most to be western. .

Who are this 'most'? Again its all in numbers....like your 'majority' idea of before. If I flew west I'd have to cover much more distance than if I travel eastwards to US. Arab countries aren't a reference point for the rest of the world.

US is western from reference points of West Asia and Europe.For example West Asia is a more comprehensive term adopted by most of the world while Middle East is used by the British and Americans. Putting Europe and US in the same bag is as same as putting West Asia and China in one bag - there is hardly any similarity.

[Shaunagh]

In terms of culturally i would have classed the USA as western because stereotypically its the western countries whichare richer and the eastern countries which are poorer.

[SlabumniLoviets]

It is still a stereotype. South American countries are western and so is the whole of Africa, if you draw a longitudinal line. Sometimes people have their stereotypes cloud and bias their judgment

[Striker475]

Originally Posted by I'm Me

First Swiss stance has been neutral since instation of democracy in the 1600s after the Swiss Federation was formed. Much of what the world has for peace like Red Cross, Reporters Sans Frontiers, Geneva Conventions were born in Switzerland. Secondly Switzerland has the largest physics research center in the world. They invented WWW and much of modern internet, it would be silly to assume they can't make a nuke on demand.

Actually, I wouldn't have assumed the Swiss were neutral until after the banning of the Swiss Guards with the exception of the Vatican following the Napoleonic Wars. Because the Swiss Guards were the most highly trained, nasty and dangerous mercenaries in the world.

US isn't western geographically, politically and culturally. Geographically it is in the east of East Asia.

That depends on your outlook, doesn't it? I mean, it's to the west of Europe isn't it? And East Asia is to the south of Russia, and everywhere has a direction associated with everywhere. You cannot say that legitimately, because everywhere is somewhere compared to somewhere else. If you go by longitude measurements, then the US is Western. But then, by longitude lines, even London is 'eastern'.

Europeans are much more sophisticated, usually more aware of world politics and issues and definitely more cultural. An average ten year old kid in France, Belgium or Greece is more aware about the world and smarter than most 20+ old Americans.

Europe generally has to be more aware. Remember, the US is similar in size to Europe. Europe is a much closer collection of countries, plus they have the European Union which means the true definition of cultures is being blurred as people move. Of course, a Belgian kid who has a Romanian kid as his neighbour is going to be more worldly than an Oklahoma kid who doesn't have the money to even go to Washington DC.

European politics is different from US too, while US is based on an absolutisation republic, European countries have a more open and majority based government, there isn't much chance to manipulate votes.

Remember the circumstances that the US constitution was set up here. It was signed while they were still fighting a war with the then-greatest power in the world, the British.

Americans are geographically, politically and culturally alienated from the world. This gives them a stereotyped view of the world and a narrow opinions coupled with inability to see through contradictory politics.

A lot of countries who don't diversify a lot are culturally and politically isolated. Take China for example - how many Chinese farmers living in and around the early regions of the Huang River are going to know about European politics? You will find that generally, the cultural centers of countries and the larger cities will be more worldly, and more recognised internationally as targets for trading and such. People in Moscow and St Petersburg will know lots about the world, but how much will a Russian living out in the Urals? The same goes for the USA. People quite often measure off of the lowest - and I will give you that especially through the Bible Belt, there are a huge number of Americans who wouldn't know which way it was to Mexico. But through the major centers, such as New York, Washington D.C., Chicago and Los Angeles, people are generally more worldly.

Another huge part is the cultural giving America gives to the world. Seriously. You turn on television in Europe, you will find that there is usually (if not always) a TV show being dubbed into French/German/Italian/Spanish/I could go on. How many shows from outside the U.S.A. do you see showing in the US? Not many. The cultural symbols of today's world and societies include the golden arches of McDonalds, the red label of Coca-Cola, the blue oval of a Ford. All American companies. The reality is, Americans don't know any different, because they're saturated with their own culture and not others. I'm sure all Americans could be more worldly if they had the chance - but the media don't give them the chance.

And politics at electiontime is never about making controversial policy and agreeing with your opponent - it's a competition. And both sides want to win.

[SlabumniLoviets]

Originally Posted by Striker475

Actually, I wouldn't have assumed the Swiss were neutral until after the banning of the Swiss Guards with the exception of the Vatican following the Napoleonic Wars. Because the Swiss Guards were the most highly trained, nasty and dangerous mercenaries in the world.

Yes they are but they are not made to go into every country and kill and forget. Swiss Guards are more of guards, protectors than assassinators unlike CIA or the Delta Force. Swiss guards are the most unlikeliest poltical or military targets of any country while CIA or Delta Force agents are considered terrorists in many countries.

Originally Posted by Striker475

That depends on your outlook, doesn't it? I mean, it's to the west of Europe isn't it?

Cyparagon termed by dislike of US foreign policy as a hatred and stereotype against west and I used plain cold logic to show that taking sides is pretty difficult against a person who is more inclusive and open minded than a majority of Americans. I chose not to point his and Spammy's own stereotypes about the rest of the world which would have embarrassed themselves and made Bush look like Einstein.

Originally Posted by Striker475

Of course, a Belgian kid who has a Romanian kid as his neighbour is going to be more worldly than an Oklahoma kid who doesn't have the money to even go to Washington DC.

A bit rich coming from a country whose citizens claim to be wealthiest. Well the least they could stop shoving their narrow world view down others throats, especially people from 'ungodly evil commie' countries who have seen and interacted with more people, cultures and races than they could in their entire lifespan.

If you understand EU politics you might also understand EU countries especially the those with rich cultural history like UK, France, Greece and Germany are quite assertive to their cultural roots. And as long as the human conservative mind exists this line isn't getting blurred anytime soon. Plain and simple sociology with a bit of psychology.

Originally Posted by Striker475

Remember the circumstances that the US constitution was set up here. It was signed while they were still fighting a war with the then-greatest power in the world, the British.

But that doesn't change the fact who has a more inclusive democracy. Europe had an intellectual and ideological victory that it managed to democratise many countries without resorting to 'bombing to stone age' policies.

Originally Posted by Striker475

But through the major centers, such as New York, Washington D.C., Chicago and Los Angeles, people are generally more worldly.

Spammy is in Illonis (maybe Chicago) and I can safely assume Cyparagon is in one of these cities. I am not sure about Capn CJ but I can safely assume he fits one of your benchmarks of worldly people. So are a few people who live in Virginia (close to DC) and make extremely stereotypical remarks. And lastly I can say with 100% percent certainity you are not a Queensland farmer yet an average farmer in rural Guangzhou has more awareness of the world and understanding of politics than you do.

You underestimate people of other countries, Hitler did that mistake, he underestimated Russia.

Originally Posted by Striker475

How many shows from outside the U.S.A. do you see showing in the US? Not many.

That is because Americans block their minds to cultures, TV programs and languages other than their own. And the same Americans label me as stereotypical, when I can make a psychological profile of one of them in 10 minutes or less.

Originally Posted by Striker475

The cultural symbols of today's world and societies include the golden arches of McDonalds, the red label of Coca-Cola, the blue oval of a Ford.

Sometimes it can make you look wiser if you just keep silent rather than making a factually inaccurate and bullshit opinions like this. With this kind of ignorance in a Melbourne guy, Australian MI will take you only if all the others died in a freak shaving accidents and no dogs are available to replace them.

By the way when I switch on a TV in Europe I see Euronews or BBC and neither of them are American.

Originally Posted by Striker475

I'm sure all Americans could be more worldly if they had the chance - but the media don't give them the chance.

For a fact, the word democracy is filtered in PRC media with collaboration of Google an American company. But I know more about democracy then Spammy does. Media isn't an excuse for gobbling up rubbish from the trash can, its stupidity and narrow minds to blame. Would you blame the US media for your portrayal of the world?

[Striker475]

Cyparagon termed by dislike of US foreign policy as a hatred and stereotype against west and I used plain cold logic to show that taking sides is pretty difficult against a person who is more inclusive and open minded than a majority of Americans. I chose not to point his and Spammy's own stereotypes about the rest of the world which would have embarrassed themselves and made Bush look like Einstein.

As a cultural stereotype, I think that the 'West' - Western Europe, the US, Canada, Australia and NZ is fairly well entrenched somehow.

A bit rich coming from a country whose citizens claim to be wealthiest. Well the least they could stop shoving their narrow world view down others throats, especially people from 'ungodly evil commie' countries who have seen and interacted with more people, cultures and races than they could in their entire lifespan.

New Orleans proved the rich-poor divide in the US was massive. The reality is, all countries have a rich-poor divide - even if the rich is Robert Mugabe alone in Zimbabwe.

If you understand EU politics you might also understand EU countries especially the those with rich cultural history like UK, France, Greece and Germany are quite assertive to their cultural roots. And as long as the human conservative mind exists this line isn't getting blurred anytime soon. Plain and simple sociology with a bit of psychology.

I'm not as good on EU politics as US, but I do understand that no matter psychological and sociological stances, the sheer exposure to different cultures resulting from the creation of the EU and the following additions from Eastern European nations will have resulted in more changes of the cultural layout in a country. You see it all over the world - when a person or group of people of similar nationalities group in an area, they change the culture of the area. Little Italy in NYC during the early 20th century, the towns such as Leeds in the UK having the areas of Muslims, areas of metropolises such as Melbourne having suburbs like Springvale gaining a changing cultural group. Despite this conservative clinging, the cultures will slowly change and evolve.

But that doesn't change the fact who has a more inclusive democracy. Europe had an intellectual and ideological victory that it managed to democratise many countries without resorting to 'bombing to stone age' policies.

No, they didn't bomb them to the Stone Age - the countries faced economic ruin if they did not, because the Soviet Union had collapsed and there was noone to back up the debts of these poor communist governments. They weren't bombed back to the stone age - they were repo manned.

Spammy is in Illonis (maybe Chicago) and I can safely assume Cyparagon is in one of these cities. I am not sure about Capn CJ but I can safely assume he fits one of your benchmarks of worldly people. So are a few people who live in Virginia (close to DC) and make extremely stereotypical remarks. And lastly I can say with 100% percent certainity you are not a Queensland farmer yet an average farmer in rural Guangzhou has more awareness of the world and understanding of politics than you do.

Oh? I'll go quiz the average rural farmer in Guangzhou on the US Constitution, and we'll see how he goes then.

You underestimate people of other countries, Hitler did that mistake, he underestimated Russia.

No, I actually think that you overestimate them. I also think you overestimate the amount of 'freedom' countries like the PRC really give their people. For freedom works against their government, despite all the changes.

That is because Americans block their minds to cultures, TV programs and languages other than their own. And the same Americans label me as stereotypical, when I can make a psychological profile of one of them in 10 minutes or less.

Is it the average American's fault that the media choose to put this on? The reality is that one American can change, but he won't be able to change the opinions of 250 million or so people when it comes to their TV viewing habits. And then the US won't be able to change the stereotype of 5.75billion or so people who have it.

Sometimes it can make you look wiser if you just keep silent rather than making a factually inaccurate and bullshit opinions like this. With this kind of ignorance in a Melbourne guy, Australian MI will take you only if all the others died in a freak shaving accidents and no dogs are available to replace them.

Hey, what symbols do you see in almost every country in the world? McDonalds, Coca-Cola and Starbucks. I'm not just talking about the West here - I'm talking about China and Africa, SE Asia and South America. These are the cultural symbols of the 21st Century - they stretch the corners of the globe.

By the way when I switch on a TV in Europe I see Euronews or BBC and neither of them are American.

Not every television channel. Because when I went to Europe, I watched Law and Order dubbed into French, and there was also CSI in French. And I'm certain that this has increased, because I've got friends in France who are fans of American television. And Euronews/BBC is not on 24/7 unless you have the Euronews/BBC only channels in mainland Europe.

For a fact, the word democracy is filtered in PRC media with collaboration of Google an American company. But I know more about democracy then Spammy does. Media isn't an excuse for gobbling up rubbish from the trash can, its stupidity and narrow minds to blame. Would you blame the US media for your portrayal of the world?

I wouldn't blame it for mine, because for a long time I've read other media sources apart from American/Australian/British. But some people, yes. Especially those who don't have any cross-exposure. Think about it - if you see the same things, day after day after day, then you will not know any different whatsoever.

[SlabumniLoviets]

Originally Posted by Striker475

As a cultural stereotype, I think that the 'West' - Western Europe, the US, Canada, Australia and NZ is fairly well entrenched somehow.

Coming from a person whose idea of culture is hating the swastika and seeing Europe as an American .

Originally Posted by Striker475

New Orleans proved the rich-poor divide in the US was massive.

We have known that ages before weather god considered being furious with Katrina. We don't need a hurricane to prove rich-poor divide as we have more access to 'reality bites' kind of studies.

Originally Posted by Striker475

I'm not as good on EU politics as US, but I do understand that no matter psychological and sociological stances, the sheer exposure to different cultures resulting from the creation of the EU and the following additions from Eastern European nations will have resulted in more changes of the cultural layout in a country.

Does that mean next time I visit Reveria, I'll see only burka clad blobs?

Originally Posted by Striker475

Oh? I'll go quiz the average rural farmer in Guangzhou on the US Constitution, and we'll see how he goes then.

Try it. The average Guangzhou farmer can beat you or your pals in Washington on world awareness.

Originally Posted by Striker475

I also think you overestimate the amount of 'freedom' countries like the PRC really give their people.

I have an Australian guy giving me estimate of freedom of my country. It is because of CPC I have two legs instead of three and no giant head. We aren't given the 'freedom to learn about god's creation' like you would have wanted or 'freedom to fuck every girl in sight' like you might do.

Originally Posted by Striker475

And then the US won't be able to change the stereotype of 5.75billion or so people who have it.

The least they can do is not try to force their stereotypes and opinion down others' throats.

Not every television channel. Because when I went to Europe, I watched Law and Order dubbed into French, and there was also CSI in French.

You sure you understood anything? Coz your French is really bad....

And I'm certain that this has increased, because I've got friends in France who are fans of American television.

I'm a fan of Greek and Egyptian civilisations and I like Aphrodite. So I guess the world is Greek or Egyptian now.

because for a long time I've read other media sources apart from American/Australian/British. But some people, yes. Especially those who don't have any cross-exposure. Think about it - if you see the same things, day after day after day, then you will not know any different whatsoever.

Another bullshit. You haven't read any news source from outside Anglo-US countries. I don't have to be in the military intelligence to say that.

[Shaunagh]

Originally Posted by I'm Me

It is still a stereotype. South American countries are western and so is the whole of Africa, if you draw a longitudinal line. Sometimes people have their stereotypes cloud and bias their judgement

I didn't say it wasn't

[Spammy]

Originally Posted by I'm Me

The average Guangzhou farmer can beat you or your pals in Washington on world awareness.

HaHa. I doubt you've ever been to D.C. Not to say that those farmers in Guangzhau aren't knowledgable, but the people in D.C. are some of the most politically aware people I've talked too(I can't imagine why ).

Originally Posted by I'm Me

You believe McDonalds and Coca Cola to be cultural symbols. Have you been living in caves or your ass licking of US made you blind to culture? You insult the definition of culture itself.

I don't what you've been thinkin'. There's no denying that McDonalds and Coca Cola are cultural symbols along with an unumerable amount of other things. Would you call Baseball and apple pie American cultural symbols? I would. Americanization and Westernization in general can be found to varying degrees in nearly every corner of the globe.

[Cyparagon]

I can safely assume Cyparagon is in one of these cities.

I'm afraid you're mistaken. I live in a town of ~2000.

[BLONDEH]

people amaze me sometimes.

personally...people dont like america because they are easy to blame for everything, so instead of digging deeper into the truth, people around the world can just easily blame and hate america. it makes things easier..plain and simple.

that's just my opinion and i'm sure i'll be ridiculed out in soon...